I have conquered them. I have deleted them. I have Actually Chris is correct. Some files are copied to a location instead of being hard linked during installation. Most of the media files are copied. If you really want to be able to tell the difference between what is an actual file and what is a Hard Link, there is a small utility you can install and use.
Go to the following website. Link Shell Extension Scroll down to the bottom of the page for the download. You don't need the the Runtime.
Dll's, they are already present in Windows 7. This utility overlays a small, red arrow on a file icon that is a hard link. You can then right click the file and select Properties. You will see a new Tab called Link Properties.
Click that tab and it will show you how many hard links are associated with the file as well as the location of each hard link. Hope this helps. Hi This is just for information. I performed some hard link research on a fairly new installation of Windows 7 RC last night and here are the results. This includes the entire system drive and then all of the major folders. The only software installed is MSO and a few utilities. Initial post installation Windows 7 Ultimate Release Candidate hard link scan.
It also is a security measure to make it much harder for applications to permanently change or modify files and resources within files than in the past. I'm facing this annoying Winsxs folder problem too. I bought my PC in Mar , in only 1 month, it has eaten up my 2. I dare not check the C drive's capacity everytime when I turn on my PC, as the available capacity for C drive is becoming smaller every 2 to 3 days.
What if the day comes when the PC tells me that I do not have enough space to start the system?? Really a headache! Based on this eating speed, my C drive's capacity will become to 0 in half year. My god! Microsoft please consier a proper solution to solve this problem!!!
Hope a timely cleaning tool can be provided in half year before I face this 0 capacity problem. The WinSxS does not really occupy the space that is reported by explorer, etc. It is not continuing to use more and more of your hard drive space. THAT'S your reply? It's the lamest I have heard in a long time I've been searching and searching for an answer but there is none available.
So, am I suppose to magically tell these programs that the disk isn't really full or is Microsoft actually going to do something about this and either update the brains in the OS to recognize that it isn't taking up all this space? The OS is reporting it's being used and I can't perform critical tasks. It's like telling someone to put a band-aid on an amputation to stop the bleeding.
I don't know about you, but in my corporation, I try to solve the source of the problem instead of putting out fires that are caused by the source,. MS won't respond because this thread supposedly has an answer They still have no way of helping us recover the "used' disk space either by making the OS realize it's not really taking up space or by coming up with a utility to help us delete these so called harmless links. Again, why do we have to scrounge up disk space by attempting to delete everything else, besides the folder that is causing the issue.
You simply need to change the way you consider the WinSxS folder. This folder is the foundation that the Windows installation is built on. Removing any part of it would be deleterious to the operating system. Regard it like you would the foundation of your house.
Removing any part of it would be like removing the foundation of your house to gain a bit more living space. As for the argument about Hard Links and the perceived use of disk space. This is a result of the nature of hard links and how they work, not by the way they are implemented in Windows. A hard link is just another pointer to a file object on the disk. It can have the same or a different name than the original file name.
The Reference Count for a file is the original file name plus the number of hard links that point to that file object. Any file that is created will automatically have a reference count of 1, so you could say that every file has at least one hard link. You can delete either a hard link or the original file name and the file object will still be there.
The file object is only deleted when the last hard link is removed and the reference count reaches 0. It's easy enough to identify hard links, determine how many hard links are on the system, where they are located, and their reported size.
However, trying to continually enumerate all of this information and then convince an installation, or utility program that the reported free space on the drive is just an illusion would be next to impossible. Thank You for using Windows 7. Unless you guys are actively dodging the issue, let me at least clarify things so you'll be able to come up with a better answer. Despite this folder not taking up actual disk space, because Windows reports that it does, the effect is the same.
Ronnie, there is no need for us the user to change the way we consider the WinSxS folder. Just like, to use your analogy, there is no need for us to understand exactly how the foundation of our house works. What matters to us is that it does work. But here's where your analogy falls apart: our house doesn't tell us that the foundation is encroaching on our living space, which is exactly like what the WinSxS folder is doing.
Then that means your design is flawed. Whether the lost disk space is consumed by phantom files or not doesn't matter. The result is the same, and from a user's standpoint, the result is all that matters. Every other file system seems to work perfectly fine with symbolic links. Although, it does not prevent the problem where the data remains intact if the original was deleted, whereas another hard link reference would save the data Someone above made the comment that it would be impossible to enumerate the number of hard links referring to a specific file and report the space properly Is that meant to be some kind of a joke?
You mean to tell me, that a scan 30 years ago, the Internet barely existed, yet today, I can run around driving tanks around and shooting Nazi's with dozens of other people online, yet you can't give me an accurate accounting of the actual space used on my system? Just to clarify, I am not a Microsoft employee. I volunteer my time on these forums to help other users like myself.
Perhaps the foundation analogy is not perfect, but I have been trying to come up with a simple description for this subject for more than 3 years and the "describe the winsxs folder and what it does, in 10 words or less" still eludes me. However, I will keep trying. I described a very excellent utility in a previous post. Here is the info again. You don't need the Runtime. Fair enough. I do hope someone from Microsoft reads this thread, though, as this is an issue that severely impacts user experience.
I understand Windows 8 is currently in development so I hope that if we raise enough of a hullaballoo about this issue, Microsoft will rethink the effectiveness of their design. Link Shell Extension. We're not talking about home computers here, this issue with WinSXS affects critical servers and unless you work for some rich company that doesn't care about how you spend money, a "few giga-bytes" is worth a lot a money for server based disks on complicated RAID arrays or SANs, not to mention solid-state drives.
Now imagine you have 50 servers running and each of them needs a "few giga-bytes" Regardless if storage is cheap the real way to brag about your design is to use as little space as possible.
The more links and junctions in some folder other than the system folder would just make my think things are not being accessed directly and all you have left is a bigger and slower pachyderm. Two system folders instead of one doesn't make sense to me. If small hard disk drives were made the way they make bigger drives are today because of there smaller size you would have faster data access.
I do understand what you are saying and the frustration you are experiencing. However, these are technical support forums and what we do here is try to explain the way Windows works, in the confines of how it was designed and developed. If something is not working the way it was designed we can usually help, but if something is working exactly the way it was designed, there is not much we can do?
Will there be a utility to 'clean up' the WinSxS folder? Will this folder be redesigned in the future? If you really want this design to be changed, you can let Microsoft know about your feelings using the following form. Your feedback will be seen by the people who actually design the OS. Windows 7 feedback - Speak to us at Microsoft.
You could also post your questions in the developer forums, maybe someone there can do a better job of explaining the 'why' about this subject. As much as I hate to say it, as my problem still exists, this is a very fair answer and I will try to pursue other avenues. As Jason said, you have given the best answer someone in your position can give, but I felt it necessary to make something clear.
The point being, if the way things work hardlinks being treated as though they consume space is the way they were designed, it's simply poor design. Or at least, poor implementation for misusing the design. Now I'm confused. The problem with attempting to trim the size of the WinSxS folder down is that most of the files, manifests and assemblies in that folder are relatively small.
You would need to remove many thousands of files before you would see any reduction in the overall size. Every program and utility in the 'Turn Windows features on or off' component use the files from the WinSxS folder to install. Some are hard linked and others are copied. The WinSxs folder also contains the entire installation for Windows 7. This means that it contains all of the driver store from the installation disk.
Hardware and software manufacturers depend on that driver store being available when their products or devices are installed. We have seen several developers who have tried to create batch files or utilities to remove components from the folder and one thing they discovered was that what worked for one system did not work for other systems because of the differences in hardware and installed software.
The other thing that was discovered was that there was no way to predict which components would be needed when particular devices or programs were installed at a later date.
I thought about this for a while, and came to this conclusion. You are right, foundation is a less than accurate analogy. I came up with this.
Possibly a bit harsh, but here goes anyway please don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to have a go at you. I just don't agree at all with the way that winsxs is designed to work. Compulsive hoarding impairs mobility and interferes with basic activities But there is no mechanisim for cleanup after these are no longer necessary, ie In the end, you have a massive archive of files or hard links that create clutter, and no mechanisim of cleanup.
Everything is kept "just in case". In the end you have so much clutter that it stops you from performing normal useful tasks. Back in the real world.. I have a laptop with gb of disk. I have gone in and deleted everything i can unused programs, disk cleanup, defrag, and moved photos etc.
There are other programs and files i can ferry around or re-download, but its a pain in the neck. So now my option is to use my network storage, but the data rate is much slower Back to the analogy, I don't think that the solution to clutter around the house is to buy a second home down the street and live between them.
I fail to see how the WinSXS folder is using hardlinks to save space. One has a WinSXS folder of roughly 3GB, and the other is 6GB Which is confusing in itself, seeing as how both of these are brand-new installations of Vista on identical virtual hardware. This size discrepancy is also reflected in the size of the VHDs, which we are trying to get as small as possible to reduce file copy times over a relatively slow network.
This issue has also plagued me elsewhere, where on an image of Windows 7, with little more than Office and Photoshop installed, the WinSXS folder has taken up nearly 13 GB of space. WinSXS seems to be a very unpredictable. While it may be a stable system that allows for the upmost expandability, it comes at a cost, which in my opinion, is not worth the gains. The VMs I am working on will not be seeing new software, they do not need that expandibility.
Servers, in general, will not be seeing new software much either. Therefore, this is largely a waste for both of these situations. WinSXS needs to be reorganized, at minimum, so that it is possible to determine what program needs what version of any specific resource, so that we may know if any particular resource can be deleted or not.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but if we delete an unused resource, wouldn't any application that needed that resource in the future be able to reinstall it, save for applications bundled within windows itself that have no other copy of said resource? And what did I already know? We in the real world of budgets, corporate accountability and fiduciary responsibility to our shareholders rarely have such a luxury. For my part, my portable device is now incapable of operation and the hard disk will shortly be scratched and the Windows partition is going the way of the dodo, replaced by a less brain-dead alternative.
I do not have a choice, something I have paid for no longer performs because it was designed by incompetents. Where can I get my money back? I can't and the billion dollar Bill gets richer at our expense - as do disk suppliers and chip manufacturers whose business model directly feeds on MSs poor engineering practices, as we are continually are forced to upgrade for no additional utility.
But what amazes me is how often people appear as apologists for this situation! And if y'all think the WinSxS issue is an expensive annoyance, here is my real-world example of something an order of magnitude worse from another MS engineering department. I have a 1. Despite the bug that cause this situation being known for half a decade, it has never been fixed by MS though in fairness they claim it will be fixed in - but this is in MS development schedule time, not calendar time.
Philip, well said. Could not have said better myself. This particular problem with winsxs is still a problem as of now and it will be I beleive till the end of life for Win7 and R2 after which it probably will not be a problem anymore as everyone will learn that something like GB for System partition is a must and 'normal' however stupid the design itself might be and concentrate on some other problem which undoubtedly will arise in the next MS OS.
I just wanted to add that poor quality design and sloppy implementations are not the property of Microsoft only while honestly I beleive it was significantly 'promoted' by Microsoft first. Its just like corporations today prefer to hire and promote lazy and incompentent programmers and software engineers and those who are competent are forced to pretend to be imbeciles to avoid being fired. Are they taking examples of US Auto industry?
Myself working with various OS and software packages I should say I damn the stupid issues with Micorsoft and its unwelcome automations sometimes but then after working with bunch of Linux installatiions I start longing for Windows convenience and feel that I'd rather buy additional memory and disk and let them work for me on Windows than keep screwing my head over the simplest tasks on Linux and wasting my time on doing repetitive mechanical tasks that would take two mouse moves on Windows.
Not to mention memorizing a pile of meaningless Command line statements or creating scripts to do everyday standard tasks. Similar for Apple - great system for personal use and games but try to use it as part of corporate network and the Windows may start looking more appealing.
Or would you try to use Adobe Connect1 server? Based on ColdFusion? Talking about stupid. Any time someting is wrong which is plenty you need to go and manualy mess with xml coding. IIS looks like a treat after that. But thats the reality. Nothing we can do about it except having forums like this and find some workarounds and fixes. Apparenly there is none for the one addressed by this thread. Except as have larger drives. Really larger. But using Win7 and R2 is inevitable with all their quirks and still maybe better than alternative OS in the end.
I just careful to devote at least 60GB to system. Also, be sure to check Windows Update Cleanup and Previous Windows installations if those options are present.
The latter one will reduce the size of the entire Windows folder significantly. Using any of these will make the service pack permanent. Doing anything else will reduce the reliability of your system. You can also run two other commands that will clear out older or out-dated components.
You can now remove packages that you no longer want need or want. You can use the commands like below or you can simply use the Add and remove Windows features option, which gives you a nice GUI. This is the command:. The Dism method fails when I enter the command either to analyze or to clean - and I am using the shell as Administrator. The system reports that the analyzecomponentstore or startcomponentcleanup "is not recognized in this context".
I am unsure as to the relevance, but recently I suffered the hang-forever problem when using Windows update. The only way that I could overcome this was to use wsusoffline, after which updates were downloaded apparently normally.
So please can anyone help me to get over this apparently unsurmountable hurdle, and show me how to clean the winsxs file? I will be extremely grateful for some guidance.
This thread is locked. You can follow the question or vote as helpful, but you cannot reply to this thread. Threats include any threat of suicide, violence, or harm to another. Select a drive or partition and click Scan button to analyze the disk space usage.
Browse from the scan result to check all files in computer hard disk. You can right-click certain files or folders to choose Delete to Recycle Bin or Delete Permanently to delete those unneeded large files to free up more space. You can also click Size column to view the files and folders with an ascending or descending order in size to quickly which files or folders occupy the most space of your computer hard disk.
MiniTool Partition Wizard also helps you better manage your computer hard disk space with its Space Analyzer function.
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